Yup. I've been saying this since 2017 when a naturopath destroyed my gut microbiome and gave me leaky gut after saying I needed to be treated for "borderline" SIBO according to a breath test. I didn't think it was necessary since it was likely just dysbiosis from antibiotic usage, but she vehemently disagreed. So, I did the month-long naturopathic protocol and completely destroyed my gut and my health. I've never regretted anything more in my life.
Sorry to hear that. I did a breath test for SIBO a few years ago and it was positive. I haven't taken any of the broad-spectrum herbals, luckily. Have you been able to restore your gut microbiome?
Unfortunately, no. The number of species you can purchase is minuscule compared to what we have in a healthy microbiome. The SIBO protocol literally eradicated many species, especially the butyrate producers. I keep waiting for Faecalibacterium prausnitzii to become commercially available. It will really help a lot of people. I supplement with C. butyricum, the only commercially available butyrate-producer, as well as some other probiotics and take several prebiotics as well as eat a wide range of fiber-rich foods. I test my gut with Thorne's metagenomic microbiome test every so often to see where I'm at. I take Tributyrin-X as well as many other supplements, but occasionally I have gut setbacks like when I had to take doxycycline for three weeks. My current attempt is focused on getting more intense aerobic activity to see if I can increase F. prausnitzii.
My butyrate producers are low as well. There was a study that demonstrated consuming kiwifruit capsules might be able to increase the F prausnitzii abundance in the gut. Capsaicin apparently feeds this beneficial bacterium as well. If you ever determine if the C. Butyricum was beneficial, please let us know. Were you able to eradicate SIBO? Thanks
Thanks Lucy for sharing. I've almost moved completely away from doing breath testing now to metagenomic testing for clients along with using clinical diagnostic skills. Also, I'd like to add that a lot of my naturopathic colleagues - here in Australia at least - are quite cautious about the use of antimicrobials. People like Jason Hawrelak and Brad Leech are really vocal about using selective antimicrobials as much as possible, avoiding ones such as oregano oil and extended use of berberine. I know some of this knowledge has slowly filtered through to other countries but we all need to keep sharing and raising awareness to speed this process. For what it's worth, my clients with seriously damaged guts have arrived at this as a consequence of rx antibiotics like Flagyl and triple therapy or year-long use of prescribed antibiotics from supposed experts at clinics like the CDD here in Sydney. I've had a few clients who are exquisitely sensitive to both pharma and herbal antimicrobials, so your work to explain "oxygen dysbiosis" has been incredibly helpful to forge a new path for treatment for these tough dysbiosis cases.
The breath testing is so Controversial- I've tested pos so many times and been on a lot of antibiotics... nothing worked.. finally my last motility Doctor said my fast motility may be skewing the tests results- but hard to know for sure... and I have 3 tick infections that can also damage the gut.. so hard to know if it is SIBO, ticks infections or something like mast cells ... Stool tests always neg... SIBO docs are still mostly in the dark about fast motility.
Thank you for sharing the article from Neurogastroenterology & Motility. We would like to widen the perspective. At Funmed clinics (Europes largest functional medicine clinic), we are well aware of the challenges and controversies surrounding SIBO breath tests and have closely followed developments in this area over the past ten years. Here are some points that highlight our approach and view on SIBO diagnostics and treatment:
• Holistic and individualized approach: At Funmed, we base our treatment decisions on a comprehensive analysis of each patient's unique biochemical profile, lifestyle, symptoms, and clinical examination. SIBO breath tests are just one part of a larger overall picture. We agree that treatment should not be based solely on a SIBO test result, but the test can provide valuable information that complements other data.
• Precision and personalization: We work with precision health, which means we use advanced measurement methods and analyses to identify and treat the root causes of diseases. This approach differs from conventional care, which often focuses on treating symptoms rather than causes.
• Treatment outcomes: Our data shows that 82% of our patients with severe or very severe gastrointestinal symptoms no longer have these at our follow-up after 11 months. This result is achieved by using a combination of dietary and lifestyle changes, nutritional supplements, and, when necessary, medical treatments.
• New treatment methods: We are also exploring and implementing SIBO treatments that do not involve antimicrobial agents, which reduces the risk of overuse of antibiotics and their side effects. This is an area we plan to research further.
• Scientific basis and transparency: We are committed to contributing to the scientific understanding of SIBO in relation to other measurement data by publishing studies based on our extensive database. We will share our insights and results to promote a better understanding and treatment of these conditions.
• Future medicine: Functional medicine represents a new paradigm in healthcare where the focus is on identifying and addressing the root causes of diseases. Currently, 70% of all severe/very severe symptoms, across all categories, disappear within 11 months in our membership program. We continue to strongly believe that this is the future approach to achieving sustainable health.
We appreciate the critical review of the SIBO hypothesis and breath tests presented in the article. We acknowledge that there is much left to understand and that we can all learn more through continued research and dialogue. Our goal is to continue developing and improving our methods to offer the best possible care to our patients.
I'm very eager to know more about your work! I was diagnosed with Microscopic Colitis in 2013, after a colonoscopy/biopsy. I never wanted to take the steroid recommended for MC. But I jumped on the SIBO train in 2014, when I remotely attended the first SIBO Symposium in Portland. I tested positive for methane. Countless rounds of various bug killers resolved diarrhea, but then I quickly relapsed. In 2021, I tested high positive for "Hydrogen Sulfide SIBO", with the newly-available test for H2S SIBO. I had suspected H2S SIBO all along, but didn't have a way to know. This form of SIBO is more difficult to treat; bug killers often don't work. The low-sulfur diet didn't work for me at all. However, a new approach to SIBO was being proffered: quit bug killers, and instead promote good bugs, using prebiotics (various fibers, etc). In 2022, a Thorne stool test result recommended LOTS of various fibers -- so I followed their protocol. My digestion/stools improved noticeably. But I still had triggers, like inulin, cruciferous, starch, sugars that threw me off. Eliminating all starch & sugar from my diet also brought improvement. I haven't improved much since then. My thought is that the gastro world is too siloed, without realizing these maladies have a lot more overlap than is realized. I suspect I have several conditions, all interacting. I'm very interested in where this critique of SIBO treatment is going!
See my previous post first......But now I'm up against the wall, as I'm developing Ankylosing Spondylitis, an autoimmune disease highly linked to both gut inflammation & dysbiosis. Some people treating AS by treating the gut -- instead of using NSAIDS, steroids, and other heavy-hitting drugs. Many are reporting dramatic improvement by eating keto (very low carb) and some by taking antimicrobials and antibiotics to kill bad bugs in the gut. I now need to take gut healing to the next level...but how?
I love the emphasis on restoring the factors of the upper intestine before resorting to treating with antimicrobials. I lectured a lot on this on my last dysbiosis talk for Allergy Research Group.
Thank you for sharing this! I've always been on the fence about SIBO, as a diagnosis and certainly how it's tested and treated, and continue to be surprised by how many functional practitioners continue to use breath testing and antibiotic/antimicrobial treatments (often with only short-term relief for their patients/clients). Looking forward to your next few posts on this!
The Taymount Clinic as you probably know, seems to be doing excellent clinical work with their fecal transfers. They are in England. Established in 2003. I am not up to speed on how they are working with small intestine dysbiosis. Perhaps they work with the entire microbiome in the gut. I've read some interviews with Glen Taylor and Enid Taylor over the years as their work has evolved and been refined. Looks very positive overall instead of using antimicrobials. -Larry Welsh M.Ac., M.A.
This is so interesting...and a bit sad and frustrating.
In Germany, SIBO/IMO diagnosis has not even made it into the general healthcare system yet.
My worsening IBS symptoms have been diagnosed (funcitonal practioner) as a mild form of SIBO/IMO and I went through rounds of Herbal Antimicrobials and restrictive diets.
I am really looking forward to your planned deep dives on this!
Isn't SIBO also a form of bacterial overgrowth, but in the small intestine? In the last days I did some research on IBS and it looks like bacterial overgrowth in large intestine, but also in small intestine can be a cause of IBS. I'm not sure if I'm right since I'm not a doctor and I don't understand all the relations so this is more of a question than a statement.
Yup. I've been saying this since 2017 when a naturopath destroyed my gut microbiome and gave me leaky gut after saying I needed to be treated for "borderline" SIBO according to a breath test. I didn't think it was necessary since it was likely just dysbiosis from antibiotic usage, but she vehemently disagreed. So, I did the month-long naturopathic protocol and completely destroyed my gut and my health. I've never regretted anything more in my life.
Knowledge about the harms of strong antimicrobials is too slow to be taken on board.
True. I honestly think the obesity epidemic across the globe is due to antibiotics altering gut microbiomes.
Especially the glyphosate used in the production of crops.
Sorry to hear that. I did a breath test for SIBO a few years ago and it was positive. I haven't taken any of the broad-spectrum herbals, luckily. Have you been able to restore your gut microbiome?
Unfortunately, no. The number of species you can purchase is minuscule compared to what we have in a healthy microbiome. The SIBO protocol literally eradicated many species, especially the butyrate producers. I keep waiting for Faecalibacterium prausnitzii to become commercially available. It will really help a lot of people. I supplement with C. butyricum, the only commercially available butyrate-producer, as well as some other probiotics and take several prebiotics as well as eat a wide range of fiber-rich foods. I test my gut with Thorne's metagenomic microbiome test every so often to see where I'm at. I take Tributyrin-X as well as many other supplements, but occasionally I have gut setbacks like when I had to take doxycycline for three weeks. My current attempt is focused on getting more intense aerobic activity to see if I can increase F. prausnitzii.
My butyrate producers are low as well. There was a study that demonstrated consuming kiwifruit capsules might be able to increase the F prausnitzii abundance in the gut. Capsaicin apparently feeds this beneficial bacterium as well. If you ever determine if the C. Butyricum was beneficial, please let us know. Were you able to eradicate SIBO? Thanks
Thanks Lucy for sharing. I've almost moved completely away from doing breath testing now to metagenomic testing for clients along with using clinical diagnostic skills. Also, I'd like to add that a lot of my naturopathic colleagues - here in Australia at least - are quite cautious about the use of antimicrobials. People like Jason Hawrelak and Brad Leech are really vocal about using selective antimicrobials as much as possible, avoiding ones such as oregano oil and extended use of berberine. I know some of this knowledge has slowly filtered through to other countries but we all need to keep sharing and raising awareness to speed this process. For what it's worth, my clients with seriously damaged guts have arrived at this as a consequence of rx antibiotics like Flagyl and triple therapy or year-long use of prescribed antibiotics from supposed experts at clinics like the CDD here in Sydney. I've had a few clients who are exquisitely sensitive to both pharma and herbal antimicrobials, so your work to explain "oxygen dysbiosis" has been incredibly helpful to forge a new path for treatment for these tough dysbiosis cases.
The breath testing is so Controversial- I've tested pos so many times and been on a lot of antibiotics... nothing worked.. finally my last motility Doctor said my fast motility may be skewing the tests results- but hard to know for sure... and I have 3 tick infections that can also damage the gut.. so hard to know if it is SIBO, ticks infections or something like mast cells ... Stool tests always neg... SIBO docs are still mostly in the dark about fast motility.
Thank you for sharing the article from Neurogastroenterology & Motility. We would like to widen the perspective. At Funmed clinics (Europes largest functional medicine clinic), we are well aware of the challenges and controversies surrounding SIBO breath tests and have closely followed developments in this area over the past ten years. Here are some points that highlight our approach and view on SIBO diagnostics and treatment:
• Holistic and individualized approach: At Funmed, we base our treatment decisions on a comprehensive analysis of each patient's unique biochemical profile, lifestyle, symptoms, and clinical examination. SIBO breath tests are just one part of a larger overall picture. We agree that treatment should not be based solely on a SIBO test result, but the test can provide valuable information that complements other data.
• Precision and personalization: We work with precision health, which means we use advanced measurement methods and analyses to identify and treat the root causes of diseases. This approach differs from conventional care, which often focuses on treating symptoms rather than causes.
• Treatment outcomes: Our data shows that 82% of our patients with severe or very severe gastrointestinal symptoms no longer have these at our follow-up after 11 months. This result is achieved by using a combination of dietary and lifestyle changes, nutritional supplements, and, when necessary, medical treatments.
• New treatment methods: We are also exploring and implementing SIBO treatments that do not involve antimicrobial agents, which reduces the risk of overuse of antibiotics and their side effects. This is an area we plan to research further.
• Scientific basis and transparency: We are committed to contributing to the scientific understanding of SIBO in relation to other measurement data by publishing studies based on our extensive database. We will share our insights and results to promote a better understanding and treatment of these conditions.
• Future medicine: Functional medicine represents a new paradigm in healthcare where the focus is on identifying and addressing the root causes of diseases. Currently, 70% of all severe/very severe symptoms, across all categories, disappear within 11 months in our membership program. We continue to strongly believe that this is the future approach to achieving sustainable health.
We appreciate the critical review of the SIBO hypothesis and breath tests presented in the article. We acknowledge that there is much left to understand and that we can all learn more through continued research and dialogue. Our goal is to continue developing and improving our methods to offer the best possible care to our patients.
I'm very eager to know more about your work! I was diagnosed with Microscopic Colitis in 2013, after a colonoscopy/biopsy. I never wanted to take the steroid recommended for MC. But I jumped on the SIBO train in 2014, when I remotely attended the first SIBO Symposium in Portland. I tested positive for methane. Countless rounds of various bug killers resolved diarrhea, but then I quickly relapsed. In 2021, I tested high positive for "Hydrogen Sulfide SIBO", with the newly-available test for H2S SIBO. I had suspected H2S SIBO all along, but didn't have a way to know. This form of SIBO is more difficult to treat; bug killers often don't work. The low-sulfur diet didn't work for me at all. However, a new approach to SIBO was being proffered: quit bug killers, and instead promote good bugs, using prebiotics (various fibers, etc). In 2022, a Thorne stool test result recommended LOTS of various fibers -- so I followed their protocol. My digestion/stools improved noticeably. But I still had triggers, like inulin, cruciferous, starch, sugars that threw me off. Eliminating all starch & sugar from my diet also brought improvement. I haven't improved much since then. My thought is that the gastro world is too siloed, without realizing these maladies have a lot more overlap than is realized. I suspect I have several conditions, all interacting. I'm very interested in where this critique of SIBO treatment is going!
See my previous post first......But now I'm up against the wall, as I'm developing Ankylosing Spondylitis, an autoimmune disease highly linked to both gut inflammation & dysbiosis. Some people treating AS by treating the gut -- instead of using NSAIDS, steroids, and other heavy-hitting drugs. Many are reporting dramatic improvement by eating keto (very low carb) and some by taking antimicrobials and antibiotics to kill bad bugs in the gut. I now need to take gut healing to the next level...but how?
I love the emphasis on restoring the factors of the upper intestine before resorting to treating with antimicrobials. I lectured a lot on this on my last dysbiosis talk for Allergy Research Group.
Thank you for sharing this! I've always been on the fence about SIBO, as a diagnosis and certainly how it's tested and treated, and continue to be surprised by how many functional practitioners continue to use breath testing and antibiotic/antimicrobial treatments (often with only short-term relief for their patients/clients). Looking forward to your next few posts on this!
The Taymount Clinic as you probably know, seems to be doing excellent clinical work with their fecal transfers. They are in England. Established in 2003. I am not up to speed on how they are working with small intestine dysbiosis. Perhaps they work with the entire microbiome in the gut. I've read some interviews with Glen Taylor and Enid Taylor over the years as their work has evolved and been refined. Looks very positive overall instead of using antimicrobials. -Larry Welsh M.Ac., M.A.
This is so interesting...and a bit sad and frustrating.
In Germany, SIBO/IMO diagnosis has not even made it into the general healthcare system yet.
My worsening IBS symptoms have been diagnosed (funcitonal practioner) as a mild form of SIBO/IMO and I went through rounds of Herbal Antimicrobials and restrictive diets.
I am really looking forward to your planned deep dives on this!
Have you watched this presentation? https://sibo-pro-course.simplerosites.com/courses/90206-free-resources/lessons/1684809-digestive-disease-week-2024-research?utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=2582669-new-dr-pimentel-with-the-latest-sibo&utm_source=lists%2F75440-SIBO-Info-Newsletter&simplero_object_id=su_tugVV5XeAk4duT2NC8jwv745
Isn't SIBO also a form of bacterial overgrowth, but in the small intestine? In the last days I did some research on IBS and it looks like bacterial overgrowth in large intestine, but also in small intestine can be a cause of IBS. I'm not sure if I'm right since I'm not a doctor and I don't understand all the relations so this is more of a question than a statement.